5120. MS JORDAN: I simply wanted to find out because we have never seen an alignment of Whitechapel Station on that and I wanted to take the opportunity to ask Mr Berryman whether he had it because that is the only way I have ever found out any information about route alignments or what they have done and what they have considered and not done. In fact, route alignment B, I got that information on 25 January 2007 and I had to present my petition on 30 January 2007, and I think that is not adequate time for public information. It may be something that we will be able to take up other than your restrictions on the route alignment.

   (Mr Berryman) Yes.

  5121. CHAIRMAN: Have you got any further questions for Mr Berryman?

  5122. MS JORDAN: No. That is it, thank you very much.

  5123. LORD YOUNG OF NORWOOD GREEN: I have a question which arises out of something that Ms Jordan said. Have you got an agreement with every school that is in that area? We covered one school and Ms Jordan seemed to indicate that there was a school that had not reached an agreement.

  5124. MR ELVIN: No. It was in relation to a school governor. What I am told is that the school governors have been told they are more than welcome to come along. One school governor has attended on one occasion, but only one. If the school governors wish to come along and wish to speak to us they are more than welcome to do so. The School Liaison Group is a liaison group of all the local schools. No-one is omitted. If anyone wants to participate that is what the Liaison Group is for.

  5125. LORD YOUNG OF NORWOOD GREEN: Every school is represented on the School Liaison Committee?

  5126. MR ELVIN: Yes. I have got a few supplementary questions for Mr Berryman. Just as a point of information because of some of the matters that have been raised this afternoon, it is not correct to say that other representatives of the community have been precluded from coming. The Spitalfields Housing Association petitioned the Commons and Mr Oudin, on behalf of the Housing Association, gave evidence to the Committee and received an assurance from us that we would continue to liaise with them, and indeed it is the Chairman of the Spitalfields Housing Association who has been chairing such panel meetings as there have been recently. I can give you the references. It is the Commons Special Committee report, volume 3, and it runs from pages 1050 to 1055. Mr Oudin gave evidence on behalf of the local housing association and the local people involved in that to the Commons. The housing association has not petitioned your Lordships' House, so it is not right to say that some of the other associations have somehow been disbarred or prevented from coming. They got an assurance from us. It is in the register of undertakings. Just for the record, if you want to see Dr Pedretti's petition, she did petition the Commons. She is in the same volume, the transcript of her petition being heard is at pages 930 through to page 934.

  5127. MS JORDAN: Sir, for the record—

  5128. CHAIRMAN: Oh, please, no.

  5129. MS JORDAN: Could I just say that I am in fact a member of that housing association committee. Mr Alan Oudin is no longer their Chair. The Chair is called Mr Askandar Ali. He is also the Vice Chair of the SSBA. We work very closely with the housing association. They were unable to get their petition together and therefore it did not get in in time, but they felt with our SSBA one, we are a sister organisation, they were quite happy to run with that, but I can assure you that we all know each other in the local community. We are all concerned about this. We own joint properties with Spitalfields Housing Association and our concerns are also their concerns, and I think it is wrong to present this as if you are trying to divide and rule us. We are the people that will be suffering when these lorries go round our area.

  5130. MR ELVIN: There is no question of us seeking to divide and rule. The point I am making to the Committee, as the committee well knows, is that we, like the Committee, are not seeking to preclude anyone being heard. I am simply making the point that the account that was being given of an attempt to exclude less advantaged members of the communities is simply wrong. What Ms Jordan has just said, in fact, is that they are represented through her own association if they are closely associated. I am simply responding to that point. If I may, I just have a few supplementary questions for Mr Berryman.

  5131. Can I just ask you, Mr Berryman, about the right turns from the Whitechapel Road into Greatorex Street?

   (Mr Berryman) Indeed.

  5132. At peak, which is for the nine months of construction, it is assessed that there will be 16 lorries using that route a day.

   (Mr Berryman) That is correct.

  5133. The working day is 8.00 am till 6.00 pm?

   (Mr Berryman) That is correct.

  5134. Which is ten hours, so that is 16 lorries spread over ten hours.

   (Mr Berryman) That is right.

  5135. Are you able to assist the Committee with whether they are all likely to come in one bunch or how they are likely to be spread out?

   (Mr Berryman) I am afraid they could not all come in one bunch because what will happen is that most of those lorries will be taking away excavated material from the sinking of the shaft, and when one is empty the next one will have to come so they will be spread out over that working day. They will be called forward either from the logistics area outside or from the lorry holding area as they are needed. We know it takes about eight or nine minutes to get from the holding area to the site, so they would be called up in that way, and they would be spread through the day in a fairly uniform pattern. I could not say exactly how many an hour, but it is one or two most hours, I would have thought.

  5136. In terms of traffic management planning, does Crossrail have anyone who is working specifically on traffic management planning at the moment and liaising with Tower Hamlets?

   (Mr Berryman) We have a team of people working on traffic management consisting of three people at the moment. It will probably be increased over time. They specifically liaise with all the local authorities but, as I think I mentioned earlier, Tower Hamlets is the one where we have more sites than any other authority so more of their effort is devoted there.

  5137. Does Tower Hamlets have someone who is dedicated to the question of the traffic management planning liaising with Crossrail?

   (Mr Berryman) I am not sure if they have a full time traffic officer but they certainly have a number of officials who we deal with on a regular basis who call on the assistance of a traffic group.

  5138. Finally, with the schools, it was suggested that the schools had never raised the issue of routing. Can we just look at one of the minutes please, which is in the exhibits bundle? It is exhibit XR5F, that is tab F, page 127.[25] It is a meeting of the Schools' Panel on 24 April of last year, and on that occasion there were representatives of at least two schools, two representatives of the London Borough of Tower Hamlets, representatives of Crossrail and other people were being copied in. Can we go please to the second page, page 128? We see at 4.0 and 4.1 that the route was walked for the purposes of the Liaison Panel.

  (Mr Berryman) That is correct.

  5139. " ... explaining what the schools may expect during construction regarding lorry movements based upon work undertaken ... ", so the Schools Panel at that meeting were actually walked around the lorry route?

   (Mr Berryman) Yes, that is correct.