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Lord Garden: My Lords, the Defence Select Committee took evidence yesterday on Afghanistan and MoD officials made it clear that there was still some way to go in NATO before there is any agreement on force generation for this new enlarged task in the south and, later, in the east. What representations are the British Government making on these force-generation proposals in order to ensure that the protection of NGOs and DfID-type aid assets is considered a sufficient priority rather than the counter-terrorist activities?
Baroness Amos: My Lords, I return to the Answer that I gave to the noble Earl. UK forces have been deployed to Afghanistan for peacekeeping work and to ensure a secure environment. I know that the US ambassador to NATO has commented on counter-terrorism issues. However, that is not the basis on which we are deploying in Afghanistan. On the security and protection of NGOs and our own staff, we take full responsibility for the protection of our staff: there is induction training and a huge amount of work is done with them not only before they go out to Afghanistan but while they are there. We also work with the NGOs operating in Afghanistan, giving them whatever advice and information we can about threat levels in addition to access to induction programmes.
Lord Tomlinson: My Lords, does my noble friend agree that the proportion of the gross national product of Afghanistan generated by drugs now exceeds 50 per cent and is rising and that, until that is under control, there will be continual problems with development and reconstruction, however it is organised?
Baroness Amos: My Lords, I am not sure that the figure cited by my noble friend is entirely accurate. The latest figures that I saw showed that the percentage of area given over to poppy production had decreased. However, although the area was smaller, the quantity produced had not changed much because of an increase in the quality of what was produced. So I think that the figure has stayed about the same. My
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noble friend is absolutely right that this is something that we, with the government of Afghanistan, must get under control. We are working with them particularly on providing alternative livelihoods, but that will take some time to establish.
Lord Chidgey: My Lords, I am sure that the noble Baroness will be aware of the concern that has been expressed about our international partners honouring their commitments to the new NATO force that is to take the lead in Afghanistan. Can she assure the House that if the Dutch, for example, do not fulfil their commitment as promised, our forces, which cannot make good that shortfall, will not be expected to engage in mission creep, which would expose our forces to dangers that they would not normally be expected to face if the force was properly organised and resourced?
Baroness Amos: My Lords, noble Lords will know that, before any deployment is made, a Statement will be made to both Houses. We do not in any way anticipate mission creep.
Baroness D'Souza: My Lords, the legacy of impunity in Afghanistan, whereby former warlords and even criminals have gained democratic legitimacy at the elections, is much against majority public opinion. A recent survey by the Independent Human Rights Commission of that country revealed that more than 90 per cent of those canvassed want justice for crimes of the past. What specific steps are the UK Government taking to promote proper accountability for past crimes?
Baroness Amos: My Lords, I am afraid that I am not aware of any specific work that we have done in that area. I will look into the matter and write to the noble Baroness if we have done any work there.
Baroness Rawlings: My Lords, I declare an interest as a patron of the mother and child healthcare clinics in Afghanistan for many years. I am deeply concerned by Afghanistan being buffeted recently by more suicide bombings. What plans do Her Majesty's Government have to protect these worthwhile bodies?
Baroness Amos: My Lords, I take it that the noble Baroness is asking a specific question about NGOs operating in Afghanistan. Of course, responsibility for the protection of NGO staff rests with the NGOs themselves. However, we work with the NGOs to alert them to the security situation and security threat, and they have access to induction training and other forms of support from our development teams. In addition, our security forces' work to secure the environment on the ground is helpful in creating the kind of environment in which the NGOs can operate.
Lord Anderson of Swansea: My Lords, there would be a legitimate concern if a disproportionate part of the burden in the more difficult areas were to fall on
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our own troops. What is the Government's latest understanding in respect of the contribution of the Dutch forces?
Baroness Amos: My Lords, there was a unanimous decision by the Dutch Cabinet in December and the issue is now being put to the Dutch Parliament, which has not yet given a decision.
Wind Energy
2.51 pm
Lord Tebbit asked Her Majesty's Government:
At what percentage of their maximum output wind-powered electrical generators were working during the cold spells in November and December 2005.
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department of Trade and Industry (Lord Sainsbury of Turville): My Lords, the Government do not have information on the load factor of wind-powered electrical generators during the recent cold spells. Data on the generation of wind from the largest wind farm operations during November and December will be available in early March but will cover only the whole of each calendar month and not the cold spells. However, a report from the Environmental Change Institute of the University of Oxford, on behalf of the DTI, found that wind power delivers around twice as much electricity in winter as in summer.
Lord Tebbit: My Lords, is the Minister aware that frequently when I ask Questions which are embarrassing to Her Majesty's Government the reply is "We don't have the statistics" or "We don't collect the statistics" or "We don't know"? Is the Minister aware that—although I understand that in some parts of my party now there is some sympathy for things being wind-driven—common sense tells us that, in those periods of cold weather when there is no wind, these generators deliver absolutely no power? Does that not make them rather like an umbrella that will open only when it is not raining?
Lord Sainsbury of Turville: My Lords, I am disappointed as a whole with the noble Lord's Question. Now that the Conservative Party has discovered the environment and that Mr Zak Goldsmith—that enemy of nuclear power—is advising the Conservative Party, we would expect a better understanding of the economics of wind turbines from the noble Lord. In spite of what he terms common sense, the situation is that wind turbines produce more energy during cold spells and the winter, and they produce more energy during the day rather than the night. So in that context, they work rather well.
Lord Redesdale: My Lords, now that the Leader of the Opposition in another place has switched to a green energy supplier, is the Minister looking forward to almost universal support for wind power from all
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three major parties? Of course, I exempt the noble Lord, Lord Tebbit, from that generalisation. If that is the case, how do the Government plan to produce more wind power?
Lord Sainsbury of Turville: My Lords, we have covered this subject innumerable times; what we should be debating is the mix of energy sources. A reliance on a single energy source is a great mistake and a balanced approach is right. The interesting question for the Conservative Party, with Mr Zak Goldsmith so totally against nuclear energy, is what its final decision will be on this issue; it has attacked us on that for a year now.
Lord Jenkin of Roding: My Lords, the noble Lord will recognise that I have pressed the issue of connection and transmission from remote renewable sources for some time. The noble Lord will also remember that he agreed with me on "no transmission, no finance, no offshore wind". Who will pay for the offshore transmission lines that might lead from transmission sites far offshore, such as the outer isles, to the main centres of consumption?
Lord Sainsbury of Turville: My Lords, in response to a previous Question I covered in great detail how we are looking at the breakdown. As I recall, there are three possibilities in terms of what the legislation will say. I cannot remember the exact details, but I will write to the noble Lord telling him what the Answer was on that occasion.
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