MONDAY 25 JUNE 2007

MS EVE RANK AND MR MARK SHRIMPTON

  Q40  Lord Lester of Herne Hill: I wonder whether you could take a message back to the Disability Rights Commission or the new Commission that if a consultation is a sham consultation, what they should do about it is to bring public law proceedings, or threaten to do so, because, as you know, it is unlawful.

  Mr Shrimpton: Yes, thank you.

  Q41  Lord Judd: The Department of Health has told us that they are working closely with the DRC on the independent inquiry into the very disturbing deaths of six people with learning disabilities highlighted by Death by Indifference. What do the DRC think are the lessons we can learn as a result of these deaths? What difference do you think it would make if people with learning disabilities train people who work in hospitals or care homes about human rights and equality?

  Ms Rank: We think it would be a huge difference, because people with learning difficulties can do training around this area. I think that would make a huge difference. Training should also be mandatory, one of the things that they should do. We think there should be more refresher training for members of staff.

  Mr Shrimpton: One of the things that Eve mentioned on the journey here today was that she did not think that individuals delivering this sort of care should receive a qualification unless they have been exposed to proper training, delivered by people with a learning disability. In terms of the lessons that were learned you mentioned a couple of things.

  Ms Rank: One of them was to close the institutions. I know there are at least two institutions that are still open. When Valuing People came into force, that was something they wanted to close by the end of 2005, and yet there are still two open, and I think there are still two too many. Also, again, regulating care better. For example, I do not think that homes or hospitals should come off the social care inspection because they are good, because they tend to fall off that register.

  Q42  Chairman: Thank you very much. We are going to have to go away to the House of Commons. The bell is about to go. Is there anything you briefly want to add, otherwise I think we are going to have to end the session. I am sorry it has been so curtailed.

  Mr Shrimpton: There was one question I know you really wanted to ask about the Independent Living Bill and we have prepared answer, if you have two minutes. Eve thinks that there is a need to make big changes to health and social care so that disabled people can be equal citizens, and today only people with very high support needs get help from their council. Often they do not have a say in what kind of support they get and lots of people, as we know, do not get any support at all. People's human rights are suffering because of this. People with learning disabilities need rights to independent advocacy and to control when support workers come and tell them what to do. They need support to be parents and they need support to be carers. The Independent Living Bill would give people these rights. The reforms would save the Government money because more disabled people and more carers would be able to work and pay taxes. Also, more disabled people would be able to live in the community rather than in expensive and inappropriate residential locations. Finally, women's groups and carers' groups support the Bill because it will protect their human rights as well.

  Chairman: Thank you very much. I am sorry it has been a bit curtailed but unfortunately we have had votes in the House of Lords and it takes our time away. Thank you very much. There may be one or two questions we want to follow up in writing with you when we have read the transcript. We will write to you if there is anything else. Thank you for your time this afternoon.