You are here: Parliament home page > Parliamentary business > Publications and Records > Hansard > Commons Debates > Commons Debates by date > Commons Debates - previous sessions > Bound Volume Hansard - Debate
Previous SectionIndexHome Page

10.34 am

Mr. Kevin McNamara (Hull, North): I want to address the House on some of the benefits that have come to my constituency from the Government and then to consider one or two points arising in Ireland.

Before I start talking about the good news for Hull, I should say that we have had one or two disappointments. We did not get our single regeneration budget money this year, for the first time ever, and we did not get our medical school, yet again. However, my constituency has had considerable help from the Government. We have an education action zone, which is changing the attitude of parents, students and teachers and is well supported by local industry. The local newspaper, the Hull Daily Mail, has led a vigorous campaign on raising standards, which is badly needed in the city of Hull, and especially in my constituency.

We have a sure start scheme, which will be of tremendous importance in parts of my constituency where we have a great many teenage pregnancies and single young unmarried mothers. That will do important work in Orchard Park ward and University ward. We shall also be a pilot area for the new deal for the over-50s.

Part of the problem is that the present Government tend to do good by stealth and do not always get theirmessage across about what is happening in individual constituencies, which is of great importance. Help for education in Hull has been of particular strength, giving purpose and ambition, for the first time, to many young people in an area where there is a lack of skilled employment and a great need for important investment to improve citizens' skills.

Although we have been given enormous help for education, we have suffered considerably in relation to access funds, the announcement of which was delayed this year. Two sixth-form colleges in the city and a

21 Jul 1999 : Column 1118

general college--Hull college, Wilberforce college and Wyke college--have all had to write to Professor Melville, chairman of the Further Education Funding Council, drawing attention to what has happened.

It might be easier for the House if, instead of making all the points at length, I read out one of the letters that has been sent to Professor Melville. It says:


grants. It continues:


    "The principle of equality of student support nationally is one which we may all feel able to support, but the reality is that students in Hull will lose out in order to benefit students in more affluent areas where the staying-on rate is already higher."

Enormous investment is being made in the education action zone in an attempt to raise pupils' aspirations, but when pupils reach the age of 16 and transfer to other institutes of further education their grant will be considerably reduced, so the carrot part of encouraging them to stay on in further education will be considerably reduced. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Education and Employment and his colleagues should discuss seriously with Professor Melville of the Further Education Funding Council the effects of such schemes in cities like Hull. It cannot be the Government's intention--indeed, it is not--that the introduction of such schemes should act as a deterrent to students staying on in education, particularly when there is such a great need to encourage pupils to take up their places.

I now turn to some matters that concern Ireland, which to a degree have been overlooked because of the attention that we have been paying to the peace process over the past few weeks. To some extent, that has hidden other things. I shall make three points.

First, I condemn the scurrilous campaign that has been waged against the Bloody Sunday inquiry, including its purpose and its origins. The campaign has involved the witnesses, the judges and the manner in which the inquiry is being conducted. If there were a campaign to undermine the integrity of an inquiry taking place in a court of law, there would be grounds for the Attorney-General to take action for contempt of court. Perhaps my right hon. and learned Friend the Attorney-General will consider the campaign against the inquiry and against the integrity of those who are taking part in it, which could affect the attitudes of witnesses. Perhaps he will consider whether the newspapers involved in the campaign are committing a contempt.

21 Jul 1999 : Column 1119

Secondly, I draw attention to two newspaper articles that appeared on 27 June about a Mr. Stobie. One was written by Ed Maloney in The Sunday Tribune and the other by Chris Ryder in the Irish edition of The Sunday Times. Mr. Stobie was on trial nine years ago for possession of weapons, which he alleged had been placed in his property by the police. It is a strange case. When it came to trial, Mr. Stobie claimed that he had been an agent of the security forces and that unless something was done he would reveal all that he knew. A full account of these matters can be found in the newspaper articles to which I have referred.

The important thing about the case of Mr. Stobie is that when possession of arms is alleged in Northern Ireland the onus is on the accused to prove that he had the weapons legitimately. The strange feature is that the police withdrew the case against Mr. Stobie nine years ago after he had made his strange outburst in court. Not only did they do that but they had entered a verdict of not guilty of the offence alleged. It is difficult to see how that can be when the onus on the defence has been changed and a statement has been made setting out the various allegations. The case is then suddenly dropped like a hot potato by the police. Bearing in mind what is coming up under Chris Patten in his report on the RUC, the connections between prosecutions, police informers and its role in myriad cases should be considered extremely carefully.

Thirdly, an inquiry is being conducted in response to the complaints made by the late Mrs. Rosemary Nelson. A leaked document was printed in the newspapers from the chairman of the Independent Commission for Police Complaints for Northern Ireland. He had produced a commentary on the RUC investigation. It is quite a damning document about the police attitude in the Nelson case. I shall read out the introduction to the commentary to enable the House to get the flavour of it. I shall not take too long because I do not want to waste the time of the House. The introduction reads:


that is Geralyn McNally--


    "about the RUC's conduct of investigations in the Nelson complaints case. This letter stated the concerns in broad terms and provided some illustrative examples. In the ensuing discussions between the Member, the Chief Constable and the Chairman . . . the supervising Member rejected any suggestion that her concerns should be expressed in terms of a formal complaint."

That suggestion was made to her by the Chief Constable. The document continues:


    "This was because her association with the investigation was on the basis of her public appointment under statute."

She was not involved, therefore, as a private citizen. The document then states:


    "To position herself as a citizen with a grievance, as opposed to an official office holder drawing attention to serious concerns, would have been wholly inappropriate and essentially undermining of her statutory role. The Chief Constable was not of a mind to exercise his discretion to have the matter formally investigated under Article 8 of the Police (Northern Ireland) Order 1987. He did, however, decide to request Commander Mulvihill of the Metropolitan Police, who had been brought in to take over the substantive complaints inquiry, to review also the original RUC investigation."

That is the background to the case.

21 Jul 1999 : Column 1120

The conclusions reached by the chairman of the ICPC read:


That is the Mulvihill report. The conclusion continues:


    "I have worked with Ms McNally for two years now and I am unaware of any defects of intellect"--

she is the supervising officer--


    "vision, hearing, memory or personal integrity on her part. The outcome of her supervision of this case was not 'the subjective view of one individual' but rather a systematic evaluation of the facts in the matter as they were presented to her. Although the report liberally strays into uninvited comment on the part played by the Commission in this investigation, Mr. Mulvihill offers no personal evaluation of Ms McNally, unlike the Chief Inspector whom, as has already been noted, he considers to be a principled man imbued with a strong sense of duty."

It is interesting that when this matter came to be considered again there was no official examination of the supervising officer, Ms McNally. That is a deficiency and it applies also to the Mulvihill report. The conclusion continues:


    "Throughout the review, the Commander is frequently faced with either accepting Ms McNally's account of events or that of the Chief Inspector. He consistently opts for the version offered by the Chief Inspector. As was stated at the beginning of this paper, Commander Mulvihill's review lacked the standing of a fully-fledged inquiry and this is reflected in its process, analysis and outcomes. This is in no way a personal criticism of him. He undertook a very difficult assignment with honesty and integrity, but the parameters which were set for the task inevitably meant that many of the opinions which were expressed by him have no more standing than that: they are opinions."

The analysis states that there were several matters of the utmost importance. The first was that the RUC initially refused to investigate the allegations that officers made death threats against Mrs. Nelson and agreed to do so only under pressure from the ICPC. When it did so, it treated the matter as a question of incivility. I accept that a death threat to a solicitor is incivility but others might suggest that it is something stronger than that, something more serious and something that should have been examined with a greater sense of urgency than was shown in this instance. Mr. Donnelly, the chairman of the ICPC, takes the view that treating the matter as one of incivility could be regarded as


    "resistance to and trivialisation of a serious matter."

Mr. Donnelly said that


    "a senior RUC officer probing the death threat claims told at least one officer under investigation to prepare a statement in advance of interview."

That is contrary to all practice on this island. Later, Mr. Donnelly states that the officers involved were given witness statements of what was being said about them. Again, that is unusual in such an inquiry. The RUC accepted that it was unusual, and it is hoped that it will not happen again.

Mr. Donnelly cites evidence of RUC officers being interviewed on serious charges and asks whether their attitudes are tolerated by the organisation. In some cases, answers to questions were no more than four lines. In many cases there were no substantive answers to questions, only "No comment" or "See my statement." That is regarded by the inquiring officer as being a rigorous inquiry.

21 Jul 1999 : Column 1121

Mr. Donnelly notes that, as I pointed out, Sir Ronnie


a matter in which a solicitor claims death threats from RUC officers. So the matter goes on. I shall not weary the House with further details of the complaints.

While we have been discussing the extremely important matter of devolution in Northern Ireland, which we hope will be achieved later this year, matters are still bubbling on in Northern Ireland, sometimes below the surface and sometimes above it. It is sometimes difficult to sustain the belief that the RUC is treating some serious matters with the proper respect and consideration that they deserve. That is shown in the Nelson inquiry and Mr. Donnelly's report, which reveal collusion between the police when threatened by further evidence given by people who have been involved on the murkier side of the security services. Collusion has also been shown in the Stobie matter.

Moreover, there has been a deliberate and virulent campaign by serious newspapers to undermine the integrity of the Bloody Sunday inquiry, and my right hon. and learned Friend the Attorney-General should consider whether that constitutes a contempt of court.

Next Section

IndexHome Page