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8.15 pm
Amendment No. 7 defines a relevant employee. I have lifted part of that definition from the clause that I mentioned earlier relating to the work force. The amendment seeks to define a relevant employee as someone
In amendments that have not been selected, I attempted to ensure that only residents could vote. The clause goes on to say that a qualifying body would be able to appoint, not elect, a person as a voter only if it undertook a ballot of its employees. We have discussed the logistics of undertaking a ballot of employees.
The proposal envisages a qualifying body registering itself with the City corporation, as would be necessary anyway because of the rateable value commitments, identifying to the town clerks, or the chief executive as he now is, the number of employees located within that hereditament, having that verified by the chief executive, and then, if necessary--in the event of an appeal, contest or whatever--the City corporation itself funding an independent commissioner to enable an assessment to be made in any disputes. Such disputes could arise from an individual employee contesting a matter, or his or her trade union representative.
I thought hard about whether to build some concept of trade unions into the amendment, but I did not want to frighten the horses. To the City corporation it would be like a red rag to a bull. Nevertheless, there would be an opportunity for individual representatives to contest the calculation of the number of employees and the registration. If necessary, that could be part of any future report to Parliament about the operation of the system, which is contained elsewhere in the Bill.
Amendment No. 13 may be the crux of the debate. Rather than have the appointment of a voter by whim, the onus must be on the qualifying body to go through some process in order to verify that the voter is acting in the interests not just of the individual company, but of those who work in that company, and those who can take a broader view in terms of the City corporation, the City area and its role in the governance of Greater London
through the Greater London Authority and the advice that it provides, along with other London boroughs, to the mayor of London.
The current legislation proposes that, when there is a dispute about an hereditament that straddles more than one ward, a determination should be based on the rateable value. I suggest, in amendment No. 16, that the determination should be based, for electoral purposes, on where the greatest number of employees are. If a building or company was located across two wards, the vote would be cast in the ward where the most people were employed. The people involved could then participate in discussion.
Amendment No. 17 provides for the appointment of voters to relate not just to rateable values, but to the number of employees. All the amendments are intended to reflect the concept of voters as individuals--living human beings--rather than buildings, as it were, or owners of businesses.
Amendment No. 30 is, to an extent, an attempt to challenge the concept of the Bill. It proposes the replacement of the word "appoint" with "elect". If a ballot were introduced among employees, someone voting on behalf of the business concerned would not be appointed, but elected. The amendment may seem trivial, but every reference to democratic processes that we can introduce in the Bill will send a message. It will send a message to the corporation of London that the days of appointments are over and that the days of rotten boroughs are over. We now demand elections. We demand democracy; our cry is "Democracy".
I actually consider amendment No. 33 to be quite weak. I apologise for it. Schedule 1 establishes a principle relating to rateable value. The original proposal was amended in Committee; I welcome that amendment, which resulted from pressure exerted by petitioners. Originally, the relevant rateable value of an hereditament occupied by a qualifying body was £200 up to £10,000; that has now been amended to £200 up to £20,000. In the case of rateable value of more than £20,000 but not over £1 million, the maximum number of persons who can be appointed will be
Amendment No. 33 suggests one person for every 1,000 employees. That is a crude calculation. I have heard that there are about 250,000 employees in the square mile, although there may be more. The problem with the amendment is that, if a firm is broken down into a number of individual units, the one vote is there for up to 1,000 employees. That confronts us with the same issue with which we were confronted by the employment rights legislation: how do we define a particular unit?
Perhaps we shall be able to solve that problem later. Perhaps we shall be able to amend the amendment in another place. The Minister shakes his head, but one never
knows: there could be a revolution in the Upper House at some point in the near future. Perhaps their Lordships will recognise that this could provide them with a bargaining gambit for their future survival.
Anyway, I want to ensure that the trade is not in individual employees, and that we do not reach a point at which companies break themselves down in order to gain the required number of votes, rather than being honest. Of course, instead of requiring one for every 1,000, we could have specified one up to 1,000, and then one for every 10,000 thereafter. That would have provided an incentive, and it was my original intention; but, again, I should like to return to the matter at a later stage.
Amendment No. 33 is consistent with the principle that we have established. We are, in effect, throwing out the words "rateable value". This is not about rateable value: it is not about how much land someone purchases, how much he owns and what his wealth is. It is about real people: it is about thousands of workers and what they bring to our city overall--not just the City of London, but the city of London according to the old Greater London council boundaries.
Amendment No. 35 is similar to amendment No. 16. It, too, deals with circumstances where there is more than one hereditament in the same ward. Again, we reject the idea that there should be an aggregate of rateable value, but suggest an aggregate of relevant employees. We want to be fair to individual companies and to enable them to exercise their right to vote, although they may not be based on a particular unit or may have split their operations between different areas in a particular ward.
The overall process that I envisage is a dialogue with the corporation about the practical implementation of the amendments. I welcome the corporation's views on the concept of the definition of a relevant employee. I understand some of the difficulties that have been experienced with that definition, and I understand the point made in Committee--I think that it was the only valid point in this regard--about the change that has taken place in the operation of City companies. Employees used to be located in the City itself, operating on a day-to-day basis; nowadays, they hot-desk. An employee of a company may visit the site only once every three or six months. We need to construct a definition of a relevant employee that takes account of modern industrial and commercial practices in the City.
Other people may be employed in the City and therefore count as relevant employees according to this definition, but may share a contract with a number of companies. Where will their ballot take place? It may be carried out on the basis of proportionality, or they may opt for a specific company.
I would welcome the corporation's views because I think that it could advise us on a number of issues. I would also welcome a discussion with the London Chamber of Commerce and Industry, the south-west branch of the Trades Union Congress and the south-west branch of the Confederation of British Industry. As we know, working practices in the City change day by day, and that is bound to affect definitions in the legislation.
"whose principal or only place of work on the qualifying date"--
the date of registration--
"is ordinarily the hereditament in respect of which the entitlement to appoint a voter arises and who works for that qualifying body."
Clause 3 contains three classifications of those entitled to vote. The first is those who are
"ordinarily in occupation for relevant purposes as owner or tenant of a hereditament . . . having a rateable value of not less than £200".
The second is a "resident in that ward". The third
"is a person appointed"--
not elected--
"as a voter in writing by a qualifying body".
A qualifying body is defined previously in the Bill. Therefore, amendment No. 7 identifies a relevant employee as someone who works in a hereditament.
"1 for every complete £20,000 of that rateable value, plus 1 for any further amount thereof less than £20,000".
On Second Reading, we were anxious about that purchasing of votes. I admit that the amendment may not be as well worded as it might be. I have suggested that there should be one vote for every 1,000 employees. I now understand the problem that that entails. It is not a practical problem; the problem is that rather than being rateable value, the currency is now employees. A body can now purchase a vote according to how many employees it has. Perhaps we should suggest to other Ministers that that arrangement could be part of the new deal. It could provide an employment creation scheme in the City. I jest, Mr. Deputy Speaker.
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