| Previous Section | Index | Home Page |
7.58 pm
Mr. Russell Brown (Dumfries): I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Linlithgow (Mr. Dalyell) for allowing me to take part in this debate and for the mountains of information that he has passed to me which he has accumulated over some considerable time. I intend to be brief. My hon. Friend has expressed his great concern about the whole issue in significant detail.
I should like to air the issue from the perspective of my constituents and to deal with what they want, because they want the chapter of the entire sad tragedy to be closed. There are, however, families in my constituency--as there are in America and elsewhere in the United Kingdom--who want justice to be done.
I am pleased that my hon. Friend the Member for Linlithgow has complimented Dumfries and Galloway constabulary. I should admit that I served as a member of the Dumfries and Galloway police authority for 11 years, four of which were as its chairman. I should add that my term as chairman was served after the Lockerbie tragedy. I have every faith in Dumfries and Galloway constabulary. Although it is the smallest force in Scotland, it is, none the less, an excellence force.
I am confident that all the evidence that has become available in recent months and years has been made available to Dumfries and Galloway constabulary. I also have every confidence that it has performed its role as an enforcement authority by investigating all the evidence.
I appreciate that there is a feeling that the tragedy is slipping away from us. I know full well that the American families think of next year--the tragedy's 10th anniversary--as a significant watershed. I can only imagine the frustration that those families feel, although I know full well the frustration that my hon. Friend the Member for Linlithgow feels after having spent many hours delving into what he regards as evidence. He has spent many hours investigating the matter and believes that he has formed a picture of what really happened.
My inquiries indicate that all the evidence produced by my hon. Friend the Member for Linlithgow and by other parties has been examined and investigated by those with a duty to do so. I think that he and I agree on two matters: we want justice to be done, and we want improved relations with the Arab world, with the consequent benefits for many United Kingdom industries and companies.
I am sure, however, that I do not have to remind my hon. Friend the Member for Linlithgow that our new Labour Government have been in power for only 12 weeks. We require time to examine closely what has happened over the past eight and a half years. I believe that now is not the time to hand over all of the relevant information to a third party or to third parties. A new Government will provide an opportunity to move the matter forward.
Mr. Dalyell:
My hon. Friend said that I want information to be handed over to third parties. I am not sure that "third parties" is how one would describe Judge Edward, Lord Clyde, Lord Hope, a Lord Justice of Appeal, in England, or a senior European judge. They are not simply "third parties".
Mr. Brown:
I am referring to involvement by another investigative authority--the Metropolitan police--although I include also some of the people eminent in the legal system mentioned by my hon. Friend.
As I said, the new Labour Government provide an opportunity. There is also an opportunity for the Libyan authorities themselves to seize upon that opportunity, because it is a two-way process. I believe that the suspects will receive a trial if the opportunity arises. As I said in my maiden speech, two or three weeks ago, I firmly believe in the Scottish legal system and that a fair trial can be conducted in Scotland. We now need all those who have spent so much time on the matter to pull together, to impress on the Libyan Government the fact that the two suspects must be handed over so that they can receive that fair trial.
The Minister for Home Affairs and Devolution, Scottish Office (Mr. Henry McLeish):
I am pleased to be able to reply to the debate initiated by my hon. Friend the Member for Linlithgow (Mr. Dalyell), and I am grateful for his usual courtesy in having given advance notice of the main issues that he planned to raise in this--his 14th--debate on the Lockerbie criminal investigation. He mentioned 11 or 12 debates, but we have factually established that the total is 14. In his most recent
As this is the first such debate to which I have responded, I should like to express my deepest sympathy for all those who lost friends or family in that terrible outrage on 21 December 1988. I also pay tribute to the unprecedented efforts of those who assisted at the disaster site and to the work of the investigative agencies involved, particularly Dumfries and Galloway constabulary.
My hon. Friend the Member for Linlithgow suggested, however, that it is no longer realistic for that police force to continue to conduct the investigation, which it began on 21 December 1988. The investigation came to be conducted by Scotland's smallest police force for the simple reason that the crime was committed in that police area. There are contingency plans--to request and obtain the assistance of other police forces--in place between police forces when dealing with such major incidents. I am sure that he appreciates that.
In response to the Lockerbie incident, the then chief constable, John Boyd, put that mutual aid plan into operation--so that, by the middle of the week after the occurrence of the disaster, more than 1,000 police officers from 11 police forces, both from Scotland and England, were involved in the investigation. The Metropolitan police was one of the police forces so involved.
My hon. Friend the Member for Linlithgow should, however, note that it became a criminal investigation once--on 28 December 1988--the cause of the crash was confirmed to be the result of the detonation of a bomb. From that point onwards, responsibility for investigation and prosecution of the crime became that of the then Lord Advocate, Lord Fraser of Carmylie. In exercising his responsibility for the prosecution of crime in Scotland, my noble and learned Friend the Lord Advocate is empowered by statute to give instructions to the chief constable on the investigation and reporting of offences.
The statutory relationship between the prosecuting and investigating authorities is reflected in the very high level of consultation between them on the case over the years, in relation to inquiries both in the United Kingdom and in foreign jurisdictions that required the issue of letters of request. As was said in reply to the fifth debate on the topic initiated by my hon. Friend the Member for Linlithgow, on 13 December 1994, the procurator fiscal for Dumfries worked full time on the Lockerbie case from the date of the event until after issue of the warrants. For most of that time, he shared accommodation with the police.
During the investigation, members of the investigating team visited no fewer than 23 countries to pursue criminal inquiries. In total, during the criminal inquiry, some 70 countries made inquiries on behalf of the investigating authorities. The Dumfries and Galloway constabulary was able to pursue those inquiries as efficiently as any other police force--with such assistance as was necessary from other police forces--and remains able to call upon such assistance when the circumstances so dictate.
I think that it is vitally important--I am sure that my hon. Friend the Member for Linlithgow will agree--to recognise the level of co-operation offered by and obtained from other
police forces. Moreover, the international dimension has been and continues to be crucial to the case. It is an active and live aspect of the investigation.
Mr. Dalyell:
Will my hon. Friend write to me on the following subject? Was there any point in time at which the Scottish police would have liked to interview certain persons in Germany, but, for some reason or other, it was made difficult for them to do so by the German police? I do not expect him to answer that question off the top of his head, but I would like a letter on the subject.
Mr. McLeish:
My hon. Friend is pursuing this matter intensely and he must have some foresight about what I am going to say. If he is unhappy with my response, I shall wish to investigate further and write to him.
| Next Section
| Index | Home Page |